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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:16 pm Reply with quote
Ares0
Will post the 1 screenie ASAP fellas. I havnt realy got time now.



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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:19 pm Reply with quote
Ares0






 Last edited by Ares0 on Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:19 am; edited 1 time in total

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:47 pm Reply with quote
Soulfly
need before and after ,next time leave alittle bit of map in screenie..

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 4:11 pm Reply with quote
Gothic
subbed

Lithuania Up.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 7:25 pm Reply with quote
Soulfly
gothic  what are you playing at lol, you have a cheek subing when you never do on time. did colin ask you to sub? do not sub unless you are asked, you got a fly look at at things by subing... ignore gothics post unless colin asked

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 7:55 pm Reply with quote
Gothic
Well it is long overdue and he shall be subed as he didnt ask for any extended period ... seems Colin lost interest and I don't blame him TO is on deathbed and will die next round or another.

Situation is hopeless for TO and there is no light in the tunnel until it is light after death.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 8:28 pm Reply with quote
Soulfly
saspi hold on till we here from colin..gothic you shouldnt have subed like that and you know it.. trying to get sneaky look at mine and saspis land?

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 8:46 am Reply with quote
Gothic
I must say in hotseats should be strong 'no alliance' rule. 'Alliance' is simply screwing up the game :

-Denmark would never grow so big without alliance with HRE.
-Mongols would make peace with Novgorod and still would be in the game if not overconfident about alliance with Lithuania.
-Poland would have to make peace with HRE if he would have to watch Lithuania.
-HRE would not attack Poland so bravely if he wouldnt believe in alliance with Denmark

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 10:02 pm Reply with quote
Soulfly
ok saspi use gothics sneaky spy file!!!!

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 10:50 pm Reply with quote
Saspi
Ok soulfly. The research our specialized investigator here in CA Headquarters has shown that Gothic has a particular inclination for... aahhhh not that spy file?
You mean his hotseat save then, Soul? Ok then my pleasure :P











On other news, the TO capital named Riga has fallen to the Grand Duke's armies.






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PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 11:59 pm Reply with quote
Saspi
— Gothic wrote
I must say in hotseats should be strong 'no alliance' rule. 'Alliance' is simply screwing up the game :

-Denmark would never grow so big without alliance with HRE.
-Mongols would make peace with Novgorod and still would be in the game if not overconfident about alliance with Lithuania.
-Poland would have to make peace with HRE if he would have to watch Lithuania.
-HRE would not attack Poland so bravely if he wouldnt believe in alliance with Denmark


You forgot.
-There would be no strong force opposing to Novgorod's invading armies that expand at will.

Alliances are screwing the game for Novgorod because they are very bad in diplomacy. You cant take diplomacy away from a hotseat game because thats where allot of the fun comes from.

If you keep complaining about stuff so that you can have MORE FU#%ING advantage over the others, then Ill start to discuss about your assasins actions. I guarantee you that if I do that, you will lose the huge advantage those assasins are giving you right now. So please, stop trying to get more advantage over the other players by complaining about very logical rules. I think you have enough advantage with not posting screenies, using your assasins in a reloading turns game and acting as if you were the admin in this hotseat by subbing.

What you are asking for us to remove, its like if I was asking not to allow reinforcment armies just because Im not good enough moving my armies to have always reinforcements in important battles. Even if we didnt allowed alliances, people would still do it. If there were people in here that couldnt follow the no reloading turns rules, what guarantees that they will follow the no alliances rules?

If you want a game without diplomacy, then that should have been discussed before the hosteat started because having no alliances is a completely different mode to play. Its like if in the middle of a 2vs2 Med 2 battle you wanted to change it to FFA because you are loosing. And you had the TO almost as an ally, so dont say you were 2vs1.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2012 12:30 pm Reply with quote
Gothic
Diplomacy should follow strategy but it doesn't - it is just EMO thing most of the time.Of course you back it up because it benefits you.Why trying to fight with skill when you can just ally with someone and gang-attack him ? Like you did with Mongols.Now Poland helps you,Denmark helps you, big deal, I can also do like that and demolish any faction with help of gang members.

I thought how to make hotseats better and I figured out it's 'alliance' thing which gives some factions advantage or screws up others.For example HRE stands no chance because Poland is allied with Lithuania.Potentially Lithuania could save HRE but it's not going to happen because you are' ALLIED' so Poland is safe on the backside and HRE must die.

Denmark used whole 'alliance' thing to mislead and then screw up HRE. If there would no alliances from begining HRE would know it's not smart to throw all armies on the east and maybe capture some Danish settlements, it was logical but he didn't do it because he was 'ALLIED'.And when Denmark got advantage in the game by HRE doing nothing he simply abondoned him.

Whole alliance concept is simply unfair and should be removed from game.It is used to mislead some factions or gain advantage over other ones.In fact - left say it clear - there is no ALLIED VICTORY, so whole alliance concept is missed.

And you can't see difference between diplomacy with alliance.Diplomacy is ok, it is for making deals, one time deals but what you do is basically helping our or using other players help to gain advantage for most part of the game.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2012 1:58 pm Reply with quote
Gothic
hre up, screens later today

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2012 11:48 pm Reply with quote
Saspi
I would like to add a new rule in which  assassins are prohibited from the game.

Right now all my buildings that are damaged would mount to 5000 gold if i wanted to repair them. I also have repaired damaged buildings in the past(more gold).  I cant even recruit assassins because gothic damaged that building (that by the way took much time and resources to construct) as soon as I built it (100% damage). There is no way for me to prevent this from happening other than destroying Gothic's faction. Even if no buildings were ever damaged, gothic could still kill my assasins as soon as they were created. Reloading turns has made the assassins an overpowered and very unfair agent in the game, so please prohibit them. You cant even regulate assassins because when a faction (Novgorod) starts with 2 assasins and can reload turns, those assassins will be able to increase their skill very fast and easy.

This has gone for many turns and I hadtolerated it, but since you are behaving as you are Gothic  I just got tired of your person and cant stand this anymore.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:05 am Reply with quote
Saspi
— Gothic wrote
Diplomacy should follow strategy but it doesn't - it is just EMO thing most of the time.Of course you back it up because it benefits you.Why trying to fight with skill when you can just ally with someone and gang-attack him ? Like you did with Mongols.Now Poland helps you,Denmark helps you, big deal, I can also do like that and demolish any faction with help of gang members.


Diplomacy has followed strategy ALL THE TIME. If it had been just an "EMO thing" I would have allied with you because I felt pity of you not having any allies (I have told you this before, why cant you understad?).  

You still need skill if you fight together with an ally, and I do admit that its easier to destroy just 1 nation but its that nation's fault that he has no allies of his own.  In this case its completely fair that Novgorod has no allies and is getting gang raped because your behaviour was very sneaky, dishonourable and silly regarding diplomacy.

Lithuania never declared war on Mongolia. If Mongolia lost Lithuania's support its because it was an AI with no value as an ally. The human Mongolia could have been safed from the untrustworthy Gothic, but they decided to give up early.

And why do you think Denmark and Poland help me? Because they have love feelings for Lithuania or Saspi? HA! Its so simple to realize that there are mutual interests behind our alliances. We chose each other after some turns because we realized we had the same interests! Had we not had same interests, the alliance would have never been made.

— Gothic wrote
I thought how to make hotseats better and I figured out it's 'alliance' thing which gives some factions advantage or screws up others.For example HRE stands no chance because Poland is allied with Lithuania.Potentially Lithuania could save HRE but it's not going to happen because you are' ALLIED' so Poland is safe on the backside and HRE must die.


HRE was close from defeating Poland, and I know that HRE were going to attack me after that , so thats why I supported Poland. Why would I even save HRE, because Im Emo and I feel pity for them? OF COURSE NOT!!! Im going to destroy the HRE because they were going to kill me after Poland. Thats how Poland shares interests with Lithuania. Thats why Poland is friend! Diplomacy HAS followed strategy. Its more than obvious, im sorry you cant see that.

— Gothic wrote
Denmark used whole 'alliance' thing to mislead and then screw up HRE. If there would no alliances from begining HRE would know it's not smart to throw all armies on the east and maybe capture some Danish settlements, it was logical but he didn't do it because he was 'ALLIED'.And when Denmark got advantage in the game by HRE doing nothing he simply abondoned him.


When Denmark broke alliance with HRE that was completely circumstantial.

Its OBVIOUS that HRE and Denmark allied so that Denmark could attack Novgorod and HRE could attack Poland, I knew this since the first bloody turn!

HRE and Denmark were smart enough to make alliances so they would only have war in 1 front, while you Gothic invaded Mongolia asap without any alliance so you OBVIOUSLY got war in 3 fronts(worst thing is, you could have avoided it, but your terrible DIPLOMATIC SKILLS ruined any chances).

Denmark broke alliance with HRE because Ranger was no longer communicating with him enough for him to rely on HRE as an ally... I always worked to get Denmark on my side because I knew they were powerful and a good prospect to help me destroy the TO and Novgord,  so once again mutual interests.

Anyone was a much better ally than sneaky Ranger and Gothic could have ever been.

Diplomacy does take skill, I didnt chose Soulfly as an ally because I felt he was a good ally, neither with Ares. Both were made my allies based on a strategy that was made with my mind not a hunch, and it has worked so well that you are complaining now.  Your diplomatic skill was bad that of course it has now backfired on you, accept it. There is nothing unfair in alliances, if you have had more diplomatic skill then you wouldnt have kept attacking Mongolia-Lithuania and now you could be our ally, but you decided to eat all the cake in one bite. Alliances is all about increasing your chances to win, so you cant ignore them.

— Gothic wrote
Whole alliance concept is simply unfair and should be removed from game.It is used to mislead some factions or gain advantage over other ones.In fact - left say it clear - there is no ALLIED VICTORY, so whole alliance concept is missed.


Of course there isnt allied victory, only one nation will win. Alliances are made to destroy common enemies, so that you have higher chances of winning. Its very simply Math:
4 Players = 25% chance of winning
2 players = 50% chance of winning.

Further proof that alliances are not unfair is that Ranger did an alliance with Ares and he then broke it to betray him. Alliances arent written on blood, nothing prevents them from being broken. Alliances promote teamplay and talks with other players, if you stop talking to them or acting as a team you will bring them against you.

Thats whats its all about.


— Gothic wrote
And you can't see difference between diplomacy with alliance.Diplomacy is ok, it is for making deals, one time deals but what you do is basically helping our or using other players help to gain advantage for most part of the game.


Why do you think diplomacy exists for? Then ask yourself what do alliances exist for? Mutual Benefit.
Thats why diplomacy fails in Middleast, because there is none to be made!!!! There are allliances made there already! The interests between allies are more powerful than those between neutral or enemies, and  thats why they have no reason to negotiate with neutrals, why would they choose the worst bargain and when they have the best already with their alies?  Diplomacy without Alliances isnt diplomacy.
Its like asking a nation not to protect its interests! Or do you really think US protects Saudi Arabia or Israel just because they are nice emos?

So yes, making and keeping alliances takes skill.
And no, its not unfair because anyone can make alliances depending on his actions.

TO END LET ME REPEAT THIS, MAYBE YOU DIDNT READ IT:
You cant prohibit Alliances for the same reason you cant prohibit reloading turns. Its unenforceable.


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