White Paper On Independence Launch
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#1: No icon White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 3:52 pm
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start it about 11-12 mins, first 18 seconds dont have headphones on lol

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47q_wXhHRpE[/youtube]

#2: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Colin747Location: Northern Ireland, UK PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 3:52 pm
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Was this the white paper recently that got picked full of holes?

#3: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 3:53 pm
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HAHA really?

lets hear it mate

#4: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Ares0Location: Widnes, England PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:35 pm
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Bye Scotland, we'll miss ya Laughing

#5: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 12:10 am
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ofcourse yous will Very Happy

#6: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Colin747Location: Northern Ireland, UK PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 9:42 am
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— Soulfly wrote
HAHA really?

lets hear it mate


I'll have a go later when I've woken up a bit but I can remember one of the things was the whole child care thing which is currently a devolved power so why is it in this paper? They have the power now to do what they say they will do in this white paper, lot's of stuff like that that have no real substance or are even relevant to independence.

Plus the whole paper is based on the assumption of using the £, which isn't Scotland's decision as Westminster will be the one that decides that, also there was nothing about the issue of EU and NATO membership

On a side note you're too easy to wind up about his stuff Razz

#7: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 2:10 pm
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the whole child care thing which is currently a devolved power so why is it in this paper? They have the power now to do what they say they will do in this white paper


not true mate, it cant be done fully with limted powers, i can get more info later if you want


http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2013/nov/lamont-lines-childcare-cuts-commission-fire
 

Plus the whole paper is based on the assumption of using the £, which isn't Scotland's decision as Westminster will be the one that decides that


its in the best interest of scotland and uk they share they pound, the edinburgh agreement that salmond and cameron signed states both will work in the best interests of scotland and the uk..

darling has already back tracked mate and now says if scotland votes yes its best for uk to share pound. he leads the better together campain!

heres some facts for you

"WHAT DOES SCOTLAND GET IF WE KEEP THE POUND?

An independent Scotland, even keeping sterling, will have the ability to create a new taxation system tailored to local needs, one that helps the economy to grow.  Critics argue that such fiscal autonomy could be granted under devolution.  That is a false claim.

First, not one iota of devolved powers has ever been granted to Scotland by Westminster except under the threat of independence.  Second, the Treasury is particularly resistant to giving up powers over corporation tax – witness its stubborn refusal to grant Northern Ireland such powers.  Third and most important, the current UK system of taxation is a bureaucratic mess that is unfit for purpose.  Devolving fiscal autonomy to Scotland inside the UK would let a Scottish government vary tax rates but it would not give Holyrood the scope to completely rewrite the tax code – that only comes with independence.

This, indeed, is the main argument of a paper published by the respected Institute of Fiscal Studies (IFS) just before the publication of the white paper.  The IFS report was seized on by the No campaign as proving an independent Scotland would have to raise taxes if it wanted to maintain current levels of public spending as the population ages.  Actually, such a fiscal gap hold true for Scotland inside or outside the UK, and for the UK itself.  With income tax anyway being devolved to Holyrood in 2016, whoever runs Scotland is going to have to cope with that.

However – and here is what the No campaign deliberately ignored and the media missed – the same IFS report pointed out that an independent Scotland (and ONLY and independent Scotland) was in a position to refashion the tax structure to promote economic growth and so raise the necessary cash to fill any so-called fiscal "black holes".

According to the IFS:

"...the current system of income taxes and welfare benefits creates serious disincentives to work for many with relatively low potential earning power. The benefit system in particular is far too complex (though the proposed universal credit will help to some extent)...Scottish independence would provide an opportunity to make sensible changes to the tax system in Scotland that successive UK governments have failed to make...the creation of a new state is surely the best opportunity that is ever likely to present itself for radical and rational tax reform, starting from first principles, which has the potential to unlock really significant economic benefits"."


and

"WHAT DOES rUK GET OUT OF A CURRENCY UNION?

One new element in the currency debate is Carwyn Jones' allegation that Wakes and rUK would suffer in a currency union.  Given that England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are in a currency union as we speak – which, doubtless, he supports - then Mr Jones' analysis is a trifle confused to say the least.

Nor is it clear, beyond finding a stick with which to beat local nationalists, why the Welsh First Minister wants to add to the business costs of Welsh firms by making them pay for currency conversions when trading with an independent Scotland.  Given that unemployment in Wales is far higher than in Scotland, Mr Jones would be better employed fixing the Welsh economy than lecturing Scotland.

In fact, rUK would gain from a currency union – which is why the SNP Government white paper thinks agreement will be reached despite the ill-informed arguments of Messers Darling, Carmichael and Jones.  As well as reducing business transaction costs and keeping cross-border trade simple, retaining a common sterling area minimises the rUK's growing trade deficit.  Taking Scotland out of sterling would add circa £50 billion to rUK's trade gap.  It would not be long before the markets punished any rUK government for running such a large and unsustainable trade imbalance.

CONCLUSION
The white paper, while it won't silence the No camp, shows the Scottish Government has thought through the mechanics of building a new nation state in more detail than, I think, any national movement before.  And in quiet distinction to the fear and uncertainty spread by Messers Darling, Carmichael and Jones, it is a tribute to the SNP Government that its white paper tries to look at what is best for rUK as well as for Scotland.  Of such leadership and wisdom nations are forged"


by law its also fact that if they uk didnt share the pound scotland doesnt have to take on any of uk debt!

also there was nothing about the issue of EU and NATO membership



i want you to watch this in full, this is the guy that just replaced moor after sturgeon kicked his ass, she also won this debate easy

http://player.stv.tv/programmes/scotland-tonight/2013-11-27-2255/



its quite simple, the snp have so far done what they said they would with limited powers, they kept there word.. so if its a case of believe a party that delivers or continue to be fucked over by westminister.. remember in the 70s scotland was told if they vote no they would get more powers like said now, they didnt get those powers. the real details on oil at the time were kept hiden to help scare, if scotland voted yes in the 70s we would be better off now!

#8: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Colin747Location: Northern Ireland, UK PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 4:01 pm
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I'll give that vid a watch when I get home.......you're in your Braveheart custume arn't you?

#9: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:48 pm
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Plus the whole paper is based on the assumption of using the £, which isn't Scotland's decision as Westminster will be the one that decides that  


scotland cant fully do this with limited powers,  if they did do it now it would mean taking money from somewhere else.. also the money generated from it wouldnt come back to scotland, it would flow straight to westminister

#10: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: NeanderthalerLocation: Netherlands PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2013 7:38 pm
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uh...... Alot of bla bla paper bla bla. WTF????? i do not get it. I hate politics!!!

#11: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 9:40 pm
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colin:

#12: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: CelticJayLocation: Germany PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 10:23 pm
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How to avoid Neddys question Very Happy

#13: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 12:19 am
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worth a watch if got time and ofcourse if interested

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dM0JsBjcx2E [/youtube]

#14: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:17 pm
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seen this early on, wee bit humour in it aswell, enjoy

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4p6FmiajEY[/youtube]

#15: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 12:35 am
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buiXDbgnc4M#t=296[/youtube]

#16: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:45 pm
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a good read

http://www.businessforscotland.co.uk/why-the-no-campaign-really-dont-want-a-scottish-oil-fund/
 
some of it quoted

The No Camps fraudulent argument

So what argument are the No Campaign using to suggest we shouldn’t have an oil fund, now that at last someone has had the common sense to suggest setting up one before its too late?  Well they claim we can’t start one because the UK is in deficit!  Lets be clear – Scotland is only operating a deficit because we are part of the UK.

We have reliable independent and official Scottish Government income and expenditure figures for 32 years which show that without having to pay for debt generated elsewhere in the UK Scotland would be in surplus right now even allowing for our share of the banking bailouts and despite the impact of losing two banks as a result of poor regulation at Westminster. Indeed, it is a credible argument that because there may be no recovering from the UK’s present fiscal position, Scotland will always be in deficit for as long as we are part of the UK.

Let’s imagine for a moment that an independent Scotland does accept its population or GDP per capita share of debts run up by the UK. The No Campaign claim that if Scotland runs a deficit then you can’t save as you are borrowing to save. However, there are several problems with this flawed contention.

1) Scotland is likely to have returned to surplus in the year before it officially becomes independent in 2016. The UK Chancellor George Osborne cant argue with that as he is predicting that the UK as whole will return to surplus in before independence is declared in 2016.

2) As explained above, Scotland’s fiscal position is better than the rUK’s last year by £4.4bn (coincidentally equivalent to 60% of the Scotland nominal deficit) and so Scotland can return to surplus far more quickly than the UK by merit of simply having a far higher GDP per head.

3) The debt that Scotland will inherit from the UK could be structured at approximately 3.0% interest and last year the Norwegian oil fund returned a staggering 14% profit. So do you pay your long term structured debt back at 3.0% or invest for the future at up to 14%?

Equating the national finances to those of an individual or household makes it easier to understand so I’ll have a go.  Many people have long term structured debt at low interest in the shape of a mortgage but they also have savings accounts, sometimes an investment account and usually a pension. How secure a financial future will you have if all your money goes into a mortgage, none into your pension and none into a savings plan?

You know the answer. And that’s exactly the No Campaign’s proposition – put all your money into your mortgage and don’t put anything into a pension or savings.

#17: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:22 pm
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for the few that are interested

at the moment we only control 7% of revenue, just think what we could do with 100% control.. scotland more than pays its way, you only need common sense to see after a yes vote we will keep the pound.

"Scotland’s strong export figures create a trading surplus that enhances UK Sterling’s balance of payments. The UK currently suffers from a large trade deficit, but Scotland’s use of the pound underpins the value of the currency. This is a key reason for why a currency union is in the best interests of the rest of the UK."

http://www.businessforscotland.co.uk/scotlands-100-billion-of-exports-provide-the-foundation-for-a-wealthy-independent-country/

#18: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Colin747Location: Northern Ireland, UK PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:31 pm
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That's like moving out and still having your parents pay your bills Razz

#19: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: CelticJayLocation: Germany PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:46 pm
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I better say nothing to this post but it is a  Mr. Green kind post...

#20: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Ares0Location: Widnes, England PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:52 pm
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ZZZzzzzz English peasants do not care...get a life!!!!

#21: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Ares0Location: Widnes, England PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 11:03 pm
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ShockedLast edited by Ares0 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 11:10 pm; edited 1 time in total

#22: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Ares0Location: Widnes, England PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 11:03 pm
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"at the moment we only control 7% of revenue, just think what we could do with 100% control.. scotland more than pays its way, you only need common sense to see after a yes vote we will keep the pound."

Split the UK up into any regions you like Soulfly and you could spin this argument for any of em.......where i live will be "fracked" to the death, doesn't mean we deserve more. I agree your country should be your own...but for god sake do it on your own...no Eng NO London and no £££££......

Can't av best of both worlds bud...independent meams what its meant too..

independence
freedom from being governed or ruled by another country:

independent
adjective (NOT INFLUENCED)
B2 not influenced or controlled in any way by other people, events, or things:
an independent enquiry/organization
They all made the same comment, quite independent of each other (= without deciding together to do so).

#23: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 11:26 pm
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the pound and the bank of england is a scottish asset, same for all 4 nations

assets have to be shared after a yes vote, if the uk were to say no to pound and assets then scotland doesnt need to take on any of the debt

its in the best interest of scotland and uk we share pound, why doesnt pm pm say no now?? if it did, it could help with the no vote...


ireland shared the pound for 50 years, is it not independent?

watch these

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4p6FmiajEY[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcxYH25gqiM[/youtube]
 
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGISzZPSCmM[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJuddbV7rb8[/youtube]

#24: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 1:11 pm
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here is the real facts on money and more, watch it all please


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W8cKHcZn60[/youtube]

#25: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: Colin747Location: Northern Ireland, UK PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:59 am
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oops

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-26166794

#26: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 1:52 pm
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haha

they are playing poker at the moment, a bluff to put doubt in the mind of voters, saying no to a currency union after a yes vote would cause alot of problems for the uk, can list if you want

the uk gov cant stop the use of pound mate, thats a fact, we can still go on and use it.. infact some say we would be better off, not havning to take on share of uk debt etc


Commenting on the Chancellor George Osborne’s announcement today that is likely to rule out an English currency union with an independent Scotland, the Adam Smith Institute’s Research Director Sam Bowman said:
“An independent Scotland would not need England’s permission to continue using the pound sterling, and in fact would be better off using the pound without such permission.
“There is very little that an English government would actually be able to do to stop Scottish people from continuing to use the pound sterling if they wanted to.
“As the American economist George Selgin has pointed out, what the Prime Minister really means is that the Bank of England would not act as a guarantor for Scottish banks or the Scottish government. Lucky Scotland: the implied promise of a bailout from the European Central Bank is exactly what allowed Eurozone banks and governments to borrow cheaply and get themselves into a debt crisis.
“Scotland’s position would be closer to that of countries like Panama, Ecuador and El Salvador, which use the US Dollar without American “permission”, and, according to research by the Federal Reserve of Atlanta, consequentially have far more prudent and stable financial systems than if they were part of a formal currency union.
“An independent Scotland that used the pound as its base currency without the English government’s permission, with banks continuing to issue notes privately and private citizens free to choose any currency they wanted, would probably have a more stable financial system and economy than England itself.
“It’s up to Scots to decide whether they want independence, but the Chancellor’s announcement today should be seen as a feature, not a bug.”
For further comment email sam [at] adamsmith [dot] org or phone 02072224995.
The Adam Smith Institute is an independent libertarian think tank based in London. It advocates liberal public policies to create a richer, freer world.

#27: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 1:59 pm
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also


The positive arguments for the retention of the British pound sterling (GBP) by an independent Scotland  outweigh the arguments for the establishment of an independent free-floating currency argue Deutsche Bank.

In September 2014 the Scottish people will vote on independence from the UK, which has raised the issue of what kind of currency regime an independent Scotland would face.

The current Scottish government has made it clear that it wishes to keep the British pound sterling as opposed to introducing an independent free-floating currency.

The idea being proposed is that an independent Scottish economy operates within a 'Sterling Zone' - the closest and most obvious  comparison being that of the Eurozone.



The benefits of keeping the British pound sterling

There are two reasons why the Scottish Government have proposed keeping the British pound.

Firstly, they believe voters will be more likely to vote for independence should sterling be retained.

Secondly, it makes economic sense.

Deutsche Bank's Macro Strategist Oliver Harvey point out the following economic benefits of sticking with Sterling:

Scotland’s business cycle is highly correlated to that of the rest of the UK which is by far Scotland's most important trading partner. It is even more correlated to the rest of the UK than certain English regions (Yorkshire and Humber, the East Midlands). Therefore, the idea that currency devaluation will boost Scottish exports fails to stand.
The argument that Scotland would not be able to finance the stock of debt it assumes from the rest of the UK by gaining fiscal independence and ceding monetary independence is seriously flawed. Instead, the risks associated with adopting a different currency could be far greater.
Were existing liabilities transferred into Scottish currency, foreign investors would not only be instantly exposed to currency risk, but it would also provide a huge incentive for the Scottish government to monetize the debt.
This could spark a crisis in investor confidence and capital flight. The massive spikes in peripheral bond yields during the height of the Eurozone crisis were associated with precisely this phenomenon as mark et priced in monetary union breakup.
Scotland would cede a substantial part of policy independence by being forced to defend the purchasing power of its independent currency.
Keeping the pound could be a crucial factor in retaining investor confidence in an independent Scotland.
Scotland would accrue the advantages of ‘importing’ the UK’s inflation regime, further strengthening credibility.
Scotland would incur significant costs by adopting its own currency.


But the UK won't want a Sterling Zone

So, the arguments presented by Deutsche Bank for Scotland using the British pound sterling within a Sterling Zone ultimately hinge on the realistation that there is little benefit to Scotland of adopting its own currency.

The problem for Scotland is that the rest of the UK appears opposed to the creating of a Sterling Zone that is shared between the UK and the Scottish.

Both George Osborne, the Chancellor, and Ed Balls, the Shadow Chancellor, have made clear they are not in favour of the proposal.



So, what would an independent Scotland do?

The answer according to Deutsche Bank would be for the Scottish to peg their currency to that of the UK.

Harvey says:  

"If the UK was unwilling to allow Scotland to remain a formal part of sterling area following independence, the Scottish government would have other options to retain the advantages provided by monetary union.

"The Scottish government could peg an independent currency to the pound, either via a conventional peg or currency board similar to the one used by Hong Kong.

"A peg may also provide additional policy flexibility in the event that imbalances were to emerge."

It should be kept in mind however that maintaining a currency pegging regime would also require Scotland to hold sufficient reserves to defend it.

"This may present a problem for a future Scottish government, given that UK reserves are relatively small relative to GDP," says Harvey.

To sum up, Scotland's business cycle is highly correlated to the rest of the UK, it is highly competitive and an exit from the sterling area could spark a market crisis if UK liabilities were transferred.

"We suggest that if the country were unable to remain formally part of the sterling area, it could peg its currency to the pound," says Harvey.

#28: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 9:07 pm
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some good points ;)


Alex Salmond's speech on currency union and independence

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fWj2hxcZEM[/youtube]

#29: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 7:34 am
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zaT1s_IAWA[/youtube]

#30: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: SoulflyLocation: Edinburgh,Scotland PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 12:23 am
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thought id spam these for anyone interested

No Camp Economics Scare Stories Debunked #1 – The Bank Bailouts
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNBLnkDawp8[/youtube]
 

No Camp Economics Debunked #2  – Know Who Subsidises Who?
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9WdLSRVaZY[/youtube]


No Camp Economics Debunked #3 – Pensions Secure and Guaranteed
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEFBGpSOJ7c[/youtube]
 

No Camp Economics Debunked #4 – Currency rUK Needs Plan A
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JarCc-rBhjo#t=154[/youtube]


No Camp Economics Debunked #5 – The Costs of Independence
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fD-62qT0Sdw[/youtube]

#31: No icon Re: White Paper On Independence Launch Author: CelticJayLocation: Germany PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:32 pm
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Thanks for sharing, Soulfly



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